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 Post subject: SMP Guidelines
PostPosted: April 21st, 2012, 12:38 pm 
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So as I'm sure some of you are aware, the rules in SMP have gotten a little clustered and confused. For example, you can pvp anywhere, but can't in some towns with pvp exceptions, but can if someone challenges you in their own house, but you can't but you can but you can't but :twisted:. I'm tired of it, I know others are as well, and rather than just grit through pointless complications in an effort to save people from common sense, I got the impulse to write out some basic rules. If I'm missing anything, edit my post and fill it in, or reply at the bottom, I don't care which. I'm just tired of trying to understand everyone's backwards logic just so I can play a game.

~ Do not grief, or in any way damage, someone else's property. If they place a block, it is theirs.

~ No mods of any kind, or exploitation of bugs that give you an unfair advantage over other players. Examples; x-ray mods, fly mods, or strength/health influencing mods.

~ Unless you are in your house, or a town that specifies not to pvp, you are allowed to pvp anywhere. The map is 10000x10000, with only maybe 10-15% of it occupied by towns. There's PLENTY of space if you desperately need to pvp.

~ You are allowed to raid any house as long as you do not damage property.

~ Respect other members of the community. Treat others as you would want to be treated.

~ Do not abuse commands for any reason. They are a privilege, not a right.


If you plan on adding something, then as a word of reminder; the point of this thread is to make the rules on SMP a little less confusing and keep things as straightforward as possible.

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Last edited by xN8Gx on April 22nd, 2012, 3:19 am, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: SMP Guidelines
PostPosted: April 21st, 2012, 1:09 pm 
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interesting side notes reagarding the raiding/griefing policy, as those cause problems once in a while:
- destruction of natural blocks to get into buildings is allowed.
- using enderperls to teleport through lwc locked doors is forbidden.
- destruction of blocks placed by other players (without their permission) to get into buildings is considered griefing. Regardless of whether they are immediately replaced or you have no intention to raid inside that building.

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 Post subject: Re: SMP Guidelines
PostPosted: April 21st, 2012, 1:12 pm 
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xN8Gx wrote:
~ Unless you are in an area that specifies not to pvp, you are allowed to pvp anywhere. The map is 10000x10000, with only maybe 10-15% of it occupied by towns. There's PLENTY of space if you desperately need to pvp.

Don't forget that players aren't allowed to attack players in their own homes, unless the owner attacks. Also, no repeated PvP without reason.

xN8Gx wrote:
~ You are allowed to raid any house as long as you do not damage property.

Also, along with no griefing, no exploiting glitches to raid others homes. Enderpearls are allowed though.

Just some things i think you should add, because these things come up and result in arguement fairly often.


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 Post subject: Re: SMP Guidelines
PostPosted: April 21st, 2012, 1:36 pm 
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Wundsalz wrote:
- destruction of natural blocks to get into buildings is allowed.


This is a rule that could really use some work if we want to be bothered having it at all. By that logic, people would need to make the areas around their underground basements obsidian or something to avoid them being tunnelled into legally, which is ridiculous. I personally disagree with this rule in that there is just a horribly drawn line between what is tunnelling and what is grief.

Wundsalz and surferdudeX wrote:
- using enderperls to teleport through lwc locked doors is forbidden. Also, along with no griefing, no exploiting glitches to raid others homes. Enderpearls are allowed though.


xN8Gx wrote:
No mods of any kind, or exploitation of bugs


Technically, being able to enderpearl through a door is a bug. So yeah, got that covered. And enderpearls are a naturally occuring resource, so why wouldn't they be allowed?

Wundsalz wrote:
- destruction of blocks placed by other players (without their permission) to get into buildings is considered griefing.


xN8Gx wrote:
Do not grief, or in any way damage, someone else's property


If they place a block, then it is theirs. No need to complicate it further then that.

surferdudeX wrote:
Don't forget that players aren't allowed to attack players in their own homes, unless the owner attacks. Also, no repeated PvP without reason.


The owner SHOULDN'T attack no matter what if they are in a PvP free town. And the second part can be summed up easier; treat others as you'd want to be treated.



Please remember, I'm trying to keep this simple. All the little exceptions we have flying around are what's confusing most players that join.

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 Post subject: Re: SMP Guidelines
PostPosted: April 21st, 2012, 2:17 pm 
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xN8Gx wrote:
Please remember, I'm trying to keep this simple. All the little exceptions we have flying around are what's confusing most players that join.

/rules should suffice for that matter. If a player bothers to search for rule information in this forum, he'll most likely be interested in details. However there doesn't exists a source where one can inform himself about details. imo this thread can and should be used to fill that gap.

xN8Gx wrote:
Wundsalz wrote:
- destruction of natural blocks to get into buildings is allowed.


This is a rule that could really use some work if we want to be bothered having it at all. By that logic, people would need to make the areas around their underground basements obsidian or something to avoid them being tunnelled into legally, which is ridiculous. I personally disagree with this rule in that there is just a horribly drawn line between what is tunnelling and what is grief.

I don't like it as well. Still it has been mentioned quite a couple of times that this is the current policy
Show
[13:02:55] <+SVB> dobby_ashy: in regards to getting into someones house
[13:02:56] <+SVB> [bluehulk4 connected]
[13:03:06] <+SVB> dobby_ashy: am i allowed to break naturally occuring blocks
[13:03:15] <+SVB> dobby_ashy: eg tunnel into their build
[13:03:30] <@intertoothh> yeah... they should block/off stuff like that.
[13:05:08] <@intertoothh> underground houses are hard to protect, or you should make all the walls from wood or something
and thus it should be pointed out here - especially as it is a grey area which might cause confusion.

xN8Gx wrote:
Wundsalz and surferdudeX wrote:
- using enderperls to teleport through lwc locked doors is forbidden. Also, along with no griefing, no exploiting glitches to raid others homes. Enderpearls are allowed though.

xN8Gx wrote:
No mods of any kind, or exploitation of bugs

Technically, being able to enderpearl through a door is a bug. So yeah, got that covered. And Enderpearls are a naturally occuring resource, so why wouldn't they be allowed?

I've seen an ingame discussion and a forum thread with a request for clarification. Furthermore some people used this method quite excessively in the past. Thus i doubt it's a bad idea to include this example in a rule guideline.
I did not state that it was not allowed to use enderperls.
xN8Gx wrote:
Wundsalz wrote:
- destruction of blocks placed by other players (without their permission) to get into buildings is considered griefing.


xN8Gx wrote:
Do not grief, or in any way damage, someone else's property


If they place a block, then it is theirs. No need to complicate it further then that.

Your formulation doesn't neccessarily lead to the conclusion that removing a block and replacing it instantly is considered griefing. One can argue that "someone else's property" was "damaged in any way", as the build is exactly the same afterwards and noone is harmed due to the modification.
a thread like this is a good spot to point out subtleties like this.

xN8Gx wrote:
surferdudeX wrote:
:
Don't forget that players aren't allowed to attack players in their own homes, unless the owner attacks. Also, no repeated PvP without reason.

The owner SHOULDN'T attack no matter what if they are in a PvP free town. And the second part can be summed up easier; treat others as you'd want to be treated.

Players are not allowed to attack players in their home. Regardless of whether said home is located in a PvP free town or not. Your initial post doesn't cover that aspect. In fact you state the opposite:
xN8Gx wrote:
Unless you are in an area that specifies not to pvp, you are allowed to pvp anywhere.

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 Post subject: Re: SMP Guidelines
PostPosted: April 21st, 2012, 2:38 pm 
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New rule since everyone is tripping over it:

No, you are not allowed to tunnel into a house, or a mountainside place, or whatever, just because they are natural blocks. If people elect to use the terrain as part of their house's aesthetics then let them.

There was a related rule referring to PvP because people were mining and then had a cry when they got killed, so we allowed the tunnelling thing to stop people complaining about it. This does not mean you can just dig every which way you please because they are natural. THAT was where the confusion came from.

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 Post subject: Re: SMP Guidelines
PostPosted: April 21st, 2012, 9:20 pm 
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When someone claims some land, they should own the actual land. If they've left a tunnel open to their basement, and you get in through there, you can raid, but no destroying blocks to get in.

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 Post subject: Re: SMP Guidelines
PostPosted: April 21st, 2012, 11:26 pm 
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@Wund Removing and replacing would still show up on hawkeye, and it does still count as grief. The second you have damaged blocks placed by another player, that is grief. It doesn't matter if you replace them, you have still broken the rule. And I'll edit in a little part about pvp in homes as well. Good catch.

@Ollie Sweet deal

@Xes As long as you aren't tunnelling through the dirt outside their house to get in, definitely. If you somehow stumble into a mine that connects to someone's house, and you follow it into someone's unlocked basement, then raid all you want. You can't really own mines.

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 Post subject: Re: SMP Guidelines
PostPosted: April 22nd, 2012, 2:14 am 
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xN8Gx wrote:
@Wund Removing and replacing would still show up on hawkeye, and it does still count as grief. The second you have damaged blocks placed by another player, that is grief. It doesn't matter if you replace them, you have still broken the rule.

exactly. However my point is that "Do not grief, or in any way damage, someone else's property." does not point this out. Common sense doesn't necessarily lead to this conclusion and thus it's a good idea to break this aspect down for the reader.

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